Let's Talk: What is Luxury? - Part 2

Welcome to "It's About Time"!

Today we will do something different: I want to have a chat on the ideologies of luxury and the many faces it may have. 

The english language defines luxury as:

luxury /lŭg′zhə-rē, lŭk′shə-/

noun

1. Sumptuous or extremely comfortable living or surroundings.
   "lives in luxury."
2. Something that is desirable but expensive or hard to obtain or do.
   "did not have the luxury of working in an up-to-date laboratory."
3. A free indulgence in costly food, dress, furniture, or anything expensive which gratifies the appetites or tastes.
4. Anything which pleases the senses, is not necessary for life, and is also costly, or difficult to obtain; an expensive rarity; Contrasted to necessity.
   "silks, jewels, and rare fruits are luxuries; in some countries ice is a great luxury."

"From the Merriam Webster Dictionary"

I like the definition, I find it quite extensive... yet I feel it lacks more depth. As we explored this topic while recording this episode, I have come to the realization that Luxury, a concept commonly understood, tends to be quite boundless into what it can include into each single individual's understanding.

To emphasize on this, I decided to query Gemini AI and asked it what luxury was and the answer was quite interesting:

Luxury is defined as a condition of abundance or great ease and comfort. It often involves indulgence in items or experiences that provide pleasure or satisfaction, though they are not essential for survival.

Historical Context

• Origins: The term "luxury" comes from the Latin word luxuria, meaning excess or extravagance. Historically, luxury was associated with the wealthy and powerful, characterized by tangible goods like precious metals, gemstones, and fine fabrics.
• Traditional Luxury: Before the Industrial Revolution, luxury was primarily a status symbol, linked to handcrafted and rare items that distinguished the elite from the general populace.

Evolution of Luxury

• Industrial Revolution Impact: The advent of mass production made luxury goods more accessible, prompting brands to adapt their strategies to attract a broader audience while maintaining an air of exclusivity.
• Modern Interpretations: Today, luxury encompasses not just material possessions but also experiences. There is a growing emphasis on experiential luxury, where unique and memorable experiences are valued over physical items.

Current Trends

• Sustainability and Ethics: Modern luxury increasingly focuses on sustainability, ethical sourcing, and personalization. Consumers are looking for brands that reflect their values and offer unique, high-quality products.
• Experiential Luxury: This includes personalized services, bespoke travel, and wellness experiences, highlighting a shift in consumer priorities towards memorable moments rather than mere ownership of goods.

Luxury continues to evolve, reflecting changes in societal values and consumer preferences.

Again, an interesting answer... but it lacks more depth. it did touch on some interesting concepts such as sustainability and ethics, but as mentioned previously it seems too general.

Not being satisfy by this, I wanted to have a deeper conversation on the topic with two people whom I believe work with luxury as part of their entrepreneurial carriers. 

Dr. Omar Fabbro, an expert in cosmetic dentistry, runs his own practices on Jumeriah Road, one of the most VIP areas in the Dubai, UAE. His perception of esthetics as well as his knowledge of the medical field, makes him a unique speaker with some incredible insights on the topic.

Ksenia Dolgova, a talented Jewelry and fashion designer, runs her practices all over the globe, working for a niche set of customers, creating bespoke pieces of both jewelry and accessories. She has travel the world and attends some of the most exclusive conventions for both Jewelry and Design, this has allowed her to nurture a deep understanding of what luxury means.

Thanks to them, we will try to understand and go deep into what the meaning of Luxury is in todays world as well as what does it mean and represent for each of us.

So sit back and relax because "It's About Time" to get started!

If you want to know more about Dr. Omar Fabbro and Ksenia Dolgova you can follow them on:

@doctorfabbro

@axiniafashion

Follow the podcast on Instagram: 

@itsabouttimeiat

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Marketing actually manipulating majority of people. But again, if it's happening like this, it's needed. So for people to start thinking themselves, not for them, for themselves. And if they're um going with the idea of the marketing, okay, it's their choice, but then will they have that um satisfaction from the moment they've got what they want and for how long the satisfaction is gonna last?

SPEAKER_01 0:28

Yeah, the beautiful point is interesting because the association with other brands, and and I believe this is what you see this many times happen in many places where you have this main road full of uh big brands and then you have the local shop. And I think it works amazingly. Yeah, I think people brand some maybe, especially someone that comes from the road wants something typical, something crafted, something special. And then you associate the cut.

SPEAKER_02 1:00

I like to play miniatures, and it's my little hub. I know that I get the best quality thing. I have a titanium handmade airbrush. For me, it's it's funny and it's so precise that you can actually do calligraphy with it. An airbrush. That's a piece of luxury. Alright, so let's continue our conversation from uh before. So we left off again. We're talking about luxury, we're talking about marketing particularly. Um, the ideology of marketing, the ideology of well, I want to say manipulation, but force feed education about that. So propaganda. Well, yeah, propaganda. Um to guide you in making decisions, and not only to guide you into giving value onto things. What do you guys think about that?

SPEAKER_03 2:01

Uh I don't like it.

unknown 2:02

No.

SPEAKER_02 2:04

Well, the way I phrased it obviously was a bit negative as well, but okay.

SPEAKER_03 2:09

Yeah, I feel uh that uh marketing actually manipulating uh majority of people. But again, uh if it's happening like this, it's needed so for people to start thinking themselves, not for them, for themselves. And if they're uh going with the idea of the marketing, okay, it's their choice, but then will they have that um satisfaction from the moment they they've got what they want? And for how long this satisfaction is gonna last.

SPEAKER_00 2:43

That's a beautiful point.

SPEAKER_02 2:44

You know, when we perception satisfaction, we're talking about expectations. Yeah, I remember I bought things because an advertisement told me so. The marketing guided me. And yes, I was disappointed. And it happened multiple times until I learned my lesson.

SPEAKER_01 3:01

But honestly, I believe that there is uh there is a line in between when marketing is marketing is actually uh education to allow you to do uh you know a wise decision about what you want to purchase. Let's say you want to compare different products, different services, and when it becomes manipulation. So if you talk about the part of manipulation, of course, it is it is what it is, it's a battle, they want to sell things, they want to you to purchase things or perceive perceiving things that are above what they are actually, maybe the intrinsic value of the thing. But education is necessary for you to purchase something, you know. For example, just to say something silly, if I buy a city car and my scope is to reach Abu Dhabi every day, and maybe my city car is electric and do only 50 kilometers per uh per uh full charge, of course it's not what I need to. How do I need to? How do I need to sorry, how do I uh learn what do I need to? So I have a specific need who will teach me what can be a good uh let's say fit for this need. So that it is education. But if the education is manipulated under marketing to sell you something particular, then uh it is tricky, you know.

SPEAKER_02 4:19

But where have you seen where have you seen educative marketing instead of manipulative marketing? But perceptive marketing.

SPEAKER_01 4:28

Education are the video, for example, just to give you an idea, uh the one that I do for my own clinic, in which I explain what is a product, what is other work, and why it is maybe better A compared to B. And based on the necessity, there is education, and of course, has also a value as a marketing. But the main scope is to educate the customer to have the right choice. Why? Because if I don't do so, and a potential client comes and wants a specific service because someone told them to buy that specific service, there might be vineyards, ceramic vineyards, then maybe it will be dissatisfied by the experience or maybe by the result because they thought they should have achieved something. So when someone comes with a very clear idea, uh it is important, for example, to me to understand where this clear idea comes from and how solid is the knowledge behind to be sure that we are not going in the wrong direction. Because it's not just I want this, okay, but why do you need this? Okay, because uh like it might be instead of uh doing, I don't know, veneers could be a simple ortho-treatment and a bleaching. You keep your own teeth and everybody will be happy. And then many times happened this, they're actually at the end of the treatment that I mean, yeah. Thank you, doctor, for getting me into this other direction. I thought that I needed this, with the being indoctrinated in that direction. So who wants to take advantage of that can do that. But then the patient, the client, it will not be happy on the long run. So it happened with what she was saying before, how much longer will you be happy with the thing? So if you've been manipulated to purchase the thing or the service, you will not be happy longer. Well, if you being educated correctly, and also yourself, you educate not only from one source, you research other people, other sources, other friends also that went through the same process. Then you can make a wise choice.

SPEAKER_02 6:19

So with one, with one, you would feel cheated, with the other one, you will appreciate and value service the product.

SPEAKER_01 6:28

Yes, I believe so.

SPEAKER_03 6:30

I haven't seen any educational videos from any brand what we see on the billboards.

SPEAKER_01 6:38

On the billboards, yeah. So the big commercial brands.

SPEAKER_03 6:42

Yes. I've seen a lot on the small brands, um, and uh actually their videos are very interesting and very intriguing, and you want to know more. And uh, I had a beautiful story when I was um studying gemology. Uh, we had one lady, also student, she came full of brands from top to bottom. I was okay.

SPEAKER_02 7:07

The Christmas tree.

SPEAKER_03 7:09

No, it's it's not, but it's okay. Like uh she likes it, no problem.

SPEAKER_01 7:14

She makes her feel good.

SPEAKER_03 7:15

Yeah, and uh we were studying diamonds, and uh at the end of the course, she said I was so stupid. I bought I forced my husband to buy me. I we were study pricing as well of diamonds.

SPEAKER_01 7:32

And then very sweet topic, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 7:34

Yes, and then she realized that how much they overpay for all the diamonds what she had.

SPEAKER_02 7:42

Yeah, big time, especially if you are buying diamonds from big brands.

SPEAKER_03 7:46

Yes, she was buying from big brands, and she was telling uh convincing her husband that this diamond, because it's from Cartier or from whatever or from any other brand, that's why it's um yeah, this price, but diamonds cost the same everywhere.

SPEAKER_01 8:07

It's like gold.

SPEAKER_02 8:08

Gold is gold.

SPEAKER_03 8:10

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 8:11

So going continuing on the topic of marketing, now I want to talk about locations. We live all of us today, we are standing in Dubai, which is uh considered one of the capitals for luxury and wealth, and who is uh an amazing machine for marketing. I mean, Dubai has rebuilt itself and its image constantly thanks to marketing. They've done an amazing job, and uh nobody can argue that. That's why that's why we're still sitting here, because we find something that we like here. But luxury this this epicenter of luxury. Would you compare Dubai to Miami or New York?

SPEAKER_03 9:00

I have never been in Miami or New York, so I cannot do something else.

SPEAKER_02 9:05

Rome, Milano, Milano, Milano, it's much more than Rome.

SPEAKER_03 9:10

It's yeah, Milano is uh cannot compare these things. Why? No, it's because it's it's different uh it's different uh concept, uh different people, different uh everything, different setup, uh and uh Rome build god knows how long uh when and uh UI it's a new country, but we're talking about luxury in luxury about heritage and luxury.

SPEAKER_01 9:37

Luxury included heritage is part of luxury, is it? It is when you buy Cartier and Cleef and so on.

SPEAKER_03 9:43

Yeah, proseco winery, what we were talking about.

SPEAKER_01 9:47

It's still heritage, you want that. And uh this is why sorry, yeah. Sorry, please, please.

SPEAKER_03 9:53

And uh here they cannot do winery because of uh weather condition. Doesn't make it uh less luxury?

SPEAKER_01 10:03

I don't know, but we're talking about heritage as well as part of luxury. This from my point of view, at least I like to have a story behind the brand.

SPEAKER_02 10:12

The luxury in Dubai. I I for me is uh is money luxury. Is you have money you can spend, you can afford, and okay, great. So you have it's more of a statement of purchasing power, the luxury ideology.

SPEAKER_01 10:28

Or maybe just the pillar of luxury is different here compared to the whole city. Again, it's like uh you if you compare with the same term, um, I know like again, Cartier with uh an unknown brand, you cannot compare with the same pillar because they don't compete on the same level, they don't compete with the same type of customer, and they might both of them be luxury actually. Exactly. Because the perception of what the customer looks for might be one direction or the other. So who is here is looking for what this city gives to them. But who is in in Italy, Milano, New York, or London, or whatever, they're looking for those things. This is why they're not here.

SPEAKER_03 11:09

Yeah, I agree with you. Oh I came to Dubai with uh the picture of this uh Pam Jumeira. For me, it was like, oh my god, the idea itself was uh fantastic. And um I was uh here almost 20 years, and uh I feel great about it. And uh all these restaurants, parties, buildings, it was uh so interesting because I haven't seen it uh in uh Russia, and uh I I really enjoyed that. But uh then with time things change and uh I want to something else, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:50

Also it doesn't mean that Russian is not at the same level or is worse, or yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 11:55

No, that doesn't mean it's it's just uh how I feel about it now, and uh I want to change, that's it.

SPEAKER_02 12:02

I remember we had an interesting conversation about Capri.

SPEAKER_03 12:08

Yes, so far.

SPEAKER_02 12:09

And Capri Capri is worldwide known as one of the capitals or the capital of luxury. I mean, uh the the vistas that you have in Capri, both historical as well as uh the amount of wealth that goes to Capri, is uh enormous. In the vibe of the city, in the vibe of the city, and and you have two Capri's. You have the Capri during the day with all the tourists, then you have the Capri after the last ferry boat leaves Capri, which takes away all the tourists, and so the people that can afford to stay on the island come out, and it's and it's it's it's a very interesting feeling. I for me it's like these peacocks that just come out to the wild, showcasing their feathers and and and strumming around the town. It's beautiful, it's really beautiful, and it is uh a very surreal experience. Now, we were talking about this because um I I had an opinion about a shop in Capri and you corrected my opinion, and uh it made me think a lot. So, could could you tell me a little bit more about what you told me when you were specifying, particularly when I told you I don't necessarily want to be associated with the big brands because I want to be niche.

SPEAKER_03 13:25

Ah, okay. Um I I would I'm dreaming about shopping Capri. Eventually, my dream come true, no matter how old I will be. And uh I have nothing against uh big brands, even though I'm not uh following them, it's not my thing. I am creating my own uh brand, not necessarily it's gonna become big. But I don't mind to have uh neighbors uh like that because uh people can come and they will have uh uh variety, and uh maybe they will choose me over the uh big brand because uh I'm planning to be in my shop myself. Imagine the owner of the shop is telling you the story, how it was done, where it started. It's uh the whole experience. And uh I and I will enjoy this because I like to see my customers. I really I had a shop here in Dubai, and uh I really like the people who were coming to us who they are, what they are, and uh then they were coming back, and I was doing it not to make them come back, I was really interested uh to see who are my customers, because uh I was trying to do this marketing strategy on Instagram several times, and the first question was who is your targeted audience?

SPEAKER_00 15:01

It's the most difficult one, by the way. Exactly. Still working on mine.

SPEAKER_03 15:05

And I was not ever I was uh never able to answer that because I have customers from 16 years old up to 70. And uh they are in totally different uh industries, different lifestyle. I cannot uh combine them. The only what make them uh all together, they like my things. That's it. And uh so how to find people in the world who like my things? No, just show like this what I have, like it or you don't like it. I'm not forcing anybody. I'm not gonna push people. This you have to buy because of this, this, that, it will give you status, it will give you this. It doesn't give you anything. It's a beautiful thing, what you will uh wear and enjoy. That's it.

SPEAKER_01 16:01

Very, very true. It's interesting because the association with other brands, and and I believe this is what you see. This many times happen in many places where you have this main road full of uh big brands, and then you have the local shop. And I think it works amazingly. Yeah, I love this. Small shops brand. Someone wants maybe so, especially someone who comes from abroad, wants something typical, maybe something crafted, something special. Okay, and that single piece will make your entire trip, and then you associate the piece on your trip to Capri.

SPEAKER_03 16:36

Yeah, like last time we went to Florence, and uh it was a tiny shop in uh in on the streets between all the shops.

SPEAKER_02 16:45

At the vintage boutique.

SPEAKER_03 16:46

Yeah, and it was uh two guys there working, and uh it was vintage stuff, and then we start talking to them. Yeah, the shop belonged to my grandmother, and uh I'm still selling her stuff, and yeah, we produce some new. I I already wanted to buy something as a memory of Florence from there. So and uh I bought it, and uh now it's my Florence earrings, exactly, and they will and they will stay my Florence earrings till the end.

SPEAKER_02 17:14

Yes, this is again the story, the attachment to it.

SPEAKER_01 17:19

It's but also the purpose, the purpose you associate with the thing, you know. I think that's that this is why we gifted things in specific days, on specific occasions, because you will connect the feeling that occasion to the specific thing. So you're buying a gift like a jewel or bag or whatever, will be ah, this is was for my I don't know, uh 25th birthday or whatever. And you remember that. But what's better than a trip? You're traveling, you just ended up to be randomly there, just an occasion, and then make it special. For example, I'll tell you one story about this, it was very interesting. It was not a small boutique, it is a brand, it was uh Dolce Gabbana. We were in Thailand with Rochelle uh because Rochelle has an uh it was used to have an office there, and uh we were walking into the this mall. It was very hot outside, we entered inside, and there was this DNG boutique, and my wife was looking for uh a small bag, and I've seen some movement, weird movement inside the shop, and I was seeing people with coat, etc. I said, okay, what's going on? I want to check. I started chatting with the guys inside the the shop, the sales advisor was uh ended up being the manager of surely the boutique, and the boutique was new, just open, not even one week. And they were having some artists coming over to do personalization for your bag. Paintings? Painting.

SPEAKER_02 18:40

That's so cool.

SPEAKER_01 18:41

And I look at my own and says, No, you need to take it. I will buy it if you don't want it. I will buy it for you. I don't care, I want you to have it. Why? Because I don't care about the bag itself, but the process of choosing how the painting, how you should put on it, it was beautiful. So they were taking a picture of the bag, the system they applied, all the all the design. You'll see them literally doing the bags in front of you. That was special. So it's not the bag, the value, it's the experience in the case, and the fact that it's a single piece, a unique piece. So, and she didn't want to buy it at the beginning, and she still wasn't happy. But what happened also? Uh, we were supposed to travel the day after or something like that. And they were not making on time. So the manager at the boutique at closing time, they finished the bag. He took a metro, he came to our hotel to deliver the bag to us in person.

SPEAKER_03 19:32

Yeah, that is a big thing.

SPEAKER_01 19:33

This is luxury. This is luxury. So even though it comes from a big brand, the this is what we're saying also about watches. The fact of the personalization approach, the fact that there is no another piece, make it unique, even though it's a big brand. But that is connected with a memory now. So I'm telling you this story, like we were saying in the other story, and it's beautiful because you remember that how it happened, how everything went uh, you know, you were not expecting that. So imagine you're going to Capri, you're not expecting her boutique. You suddenly discover the boutique and say, Yeah, wow, it's beautiful. And the story behind she's uh also teaching you about, you know, make you understand why these things is like this, these things is like that, and she's speaking out of passion. That makes it the experience. I think it's beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 20:22

It is it is really beautiful. I mean, I I can imagine the whole scene of the artist painting the bag, it must have been fantastic.

SPEAKER_01 20:30

Also, because it was only for like two, three days, and we managed to get that in the top. That's really cool.

SPEAKER_02 20:36

Yeah, that is fantastic. So then what is luxury again? Because we're talking about giving meaning, giving feeling, memories, uh, uniqueness, scarcity, uh rarity. What is luxury? Because all of us have an understanding. We could sit here, look at something, say, Yeah, that that that could be luxury. Then again, that could be a symbol of luxury, that could be luxurious in itself. Is having a Ferrari a luxury?

SPEAKER_03 21:12

Not for me. I'm not fan of cars.

SPEAKER_01 21:16

I'm using Ferrari again because it's a well-known weapons. Everybody knows about that. But again, itself having a Ferrari doesn't is no luxury. Itself as a as a as a thing, as a car. Because again, for example, for me, I like Ferrari. Yes, of course I like Ferrari. You don't fit in a Ferrari. I fit in certain Ferrari. Ah, yeah, you did. Okay. And I test drive them also. I like them. I fit there are some models in which thank God I'm fitting. But again. Dr. Omer is uh two meters and three centimeters. Yes. So there are some Ferrari which I'm fitting for. There are like four models, no more than that, four or five models. Now the new one that came out, I tried uh that one actually fitting. But again, for example. I went for a test drive, and the first thing I thought says, okay, I would like to have my baby with me. Does it fit a babysit? Can I place a babysit on the back? Do we have a seat in the back? So even though it's supposedly be a luxury car, the fact that it's missing something that for me is viable. And I want to have a ride in a finale with my son, it makes it useless. So if I want to have the car, I must have space for my baby. Then makes it okay. This is something that it could be interesting to have in that way. Okay. But itself, the car itself is not luxury, even though it takes time to be delivered, even though, because again, it's just about money. So you can afford it or not. If you can afford it, you might enter into the waiting list to get access to, or you might be introduced to. But again, is that there is rarity? No. How many cars do they produce every year? You can find one. Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 22:57

If you look for it, you'll find it.

SPEAKER_01 22:58

Look at the used market for that. Yeah, exactly. How many of those are available? Plenty. So it is a symbol of sportiveness, of uh, you know, Formula One. So if you are looking for the symbol and you like the symbol, of course it's the car for you. But for me, the value of the things I like the car, I like Did yet to have it. But again, I know there's not luxury. That's the thing. I buy it. I will, if I will buy it, I will buy it knowing there's not luxury. Knowing there's a is a beautiful tool.

SPEAKER_02 23:28

Well, let's talk about then what is considered today uh the most luxurious vehicle in the world, which is uh the Rolls-Royce. Both of you know the Rolls-Royce. Yeah, I I have ridden on Rolls-Royce, and for me, it's just a car.

SPEAKER_01 23:44

I like it. I like it too, to be honest. But again, it's so comfy. It's cool also, it's a cool car indeed. But again, it is that luxury probably is the most luxurious experience that you can have in a car as a as a feeling, as a perception inside. Okay, so because the car has a purpose, a jewel doesn't have the specific purpose. A watch is obsolete nowadays. You have a what you have a mobile phone. Yes, so maybe luxury is connected with the fact that it is not useful. So it's not a painting, it doesn't have a purpose by himself. Is so we create the purpose because we want to admire the thing, we want to wear the things, it makes us feel good, like you were saying. You go in the living room, you see the painting. Fantastic. By himself, you don't need a painting to live. But you need a car to move, you need mobility, you need to travel, you need to have access to flex to movement.

SPEAKER_03 24:40

You can travel by bus. Actually, people need very little to live.

SPEAKER_01 24:45

In reality, yes. We had this discussion, I guess. You can live with very little if you have it all the time. Even a horse. Riding a horse, is that luxury? Uh well, if you ask yes.

SPEAKER_03 24:57

Yeah, now if you know it, it is.

SPEAKER_01 24:59

Yes, uh because it's useless. This is why it's luxury when it was a necessity, it was not luxury.

SPEAKER_03 25:06

But there is people who are having uh horse farms and they're riding the horse every day.

SPEAKER_02 25:11

Yeah, the cowboys.

SPEAKER_03 25:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:13

They're not riding in luxury, they have their saddle, uh, yeah, because they're lucky boots.

SPEAKER_01 25:19

Because that is the lifestyle. Again, because they need that. But it it is not uh something that you don't need, that you do with purpose. Because you are here in Dubai, you go maybe horse riding, it's a fantastic experience. I like it too. But that's luxury from my point of view here, because you don't need a horse in your life, while the cowboy they need it for their work. So even for you, you're dealing with how many stones every day? Even you, Christopher, how many stones every day? How many bars of gold and things do you handle? Is that luxury because you handle them?

SPEAKER_00 25:51

No.

SPEAKER_01 25:52

Because it's your job, but what you create in the case creates something that's unique, but it's uh is uh useless. A watch is useless. So is the purpose from my point of view also connected with that? Luxury needs a purpose. You need to have a uh for you need to value something, but does it need to have a usage, a direct usage? So that makes the thing for you special. Like they were saying they hadn't painted like is that necessary?

SPEAKER_02 26:32

No, yeah, but you know what? Here here I'm gonna put uh uh a finger somewhere else, man, because you you work with tools in your profession, yeah. Having the best tool, the best tool. For example, I like to paint miniatures, and it's my little hobby, but I know that I get the best quality things to do my hobby. I have a titanium handmade uh airbrush, that's a luxury, which it's it's yes, for me is it's signed and it's so precise that you can actually do calligraphy with it. An airbrush.

SPEAKER_01 27:20

That's a piece of luxury.

SPEAKER_02 27:22

But unnecessary.

SPEAKER_01 27:24

Wait, but at the same time, as you you specify the thing, you specify that you can write with that for how thin it is. So he has a purpose, right? But I don't write with it. But has a purpose, has a purpose of being used maybe on the miniature for doing certain details that I don't know, I'm not aware of.

SPEAKER_02 27:38

But other airbrushes can do the same.

SPEAKER_01 27:41

Just this one is you want the the more I know you, Chris.

SPEAKER_02 27:45

You only buy the topic. It's my toy, and I want the best.

SPEAKER_03 27:50

Yeah, the toy. This is the main important word. All the actually, it's uh part of the game. We're just playing with it one way or another. So we're just talking about toys, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:04

But toys, uh, I think is it is not correct. Why not? Doesn't it bring you joy? Yes, but you play with toys, and you play with your you play with it with a aerographer, but uh pina, but you don't play with a jewel. Really? Even though you play with watches, because I like to hand wind them on the room. I was gonna go there, man. Yes, but you know, maybe it's about a ritual they have with the thing. You know, I like the hand wounded watches because every time I need to take the watch, I need to control if it's keeping the time. Hand winded, and I like the ritual.

SPEAKER_02 28:41

You like to polish them? I like to polish them, you like to put the the the balsam on the crocodile skin.

SPEAKER_01 28:47

Yes, but also I like to do the coffee in the morning. So you like the small ritual of doing the thing.

SPEAKER_02 28:56

Yeah, but for example, you you're saying that people don't play with jewelry. I would like to ask nothing aware. I don't if you're talking about it.

SPEAKER_03 29:04

Every day I'm playing with that. Whenever I'm getting uh ready, I'm choosing which one to wear, I'm mixing them all the time different ways. It is part of the game. It is actually, yeah. It feels so good.

SPEAKER_02 29:20

Give you satisfaction today. That's true, actually. And you know, now I remember something else. Fabriger. When we went to St. Petersburg, which Omar, when you'll come to St. Petersburg with us, we'll take you. We went to the Faberger Museum, where they have the collection of all these beautiful jewelry pieces made by Faberget and his team.

SPEAKER_03 29:41

Have zero purpose, they're all toys. This is what I said zero purpose.

SPEAKER_01 29:45

They're all toys, yeah. But actually, you ever been um to the Dubai Watch Week? This been, I think, like I haven't yet. Okay, there was the um Bancliffe stand was fantastic. Yet all these kind of uh um, I don't know how to call it, mechanical robots they were moving with the with the birds singing. Automatons. They're called automatons. I thought it was beautiful with the with the enameling made by hands with the fantastic. And they were all all this stand was about this kind of automatons, and everything was moving, and everything has a complex way to do simple things. This is also a thing, complex way to do simple things. Why doing, like we were saying at the beginning of our actually uh chat? Why doing something in an easy way where you can do it, you know, in a more uh luxury way, more pleasant way, more aesthetically pleasant way? So it doesn't open like this, you rotate and open maybe in a weird way. And the things don't move in a certain specific way that you expect him to move might move in a different way. So the small surprise, they make him maybe more into the toy thing that you were saying before. But they're sophisticated, luxury, handmade, very rare to do, especially those they make it special, otherwise we'll be and they make it desirable, very desirable. If you, you know, it was the best from my point of view.

SPEAKER_03 31:09

And they are not screaming about it on every billboard.

SPEAKER_01 31:12

Exactly. And there was the lady who was doing actually denameling on the spot, and I was showing all the process. There was a table like this, she was at the head, and she was uh teaching people how to do that, and this is the educational part I was referring to. So they are not pushing you to buy, but they educate you why this is special in this way, why what does it take to do it? There was all the process of grinding the glass to the denameling, how does work the oven and everything? There was all a learning part inside the stand that was fantastic from my point of view.

SPEAKER_03 31:43

And it creates a huge interest, and uh, you don't need to manipulate people to buy it.

SPEAKER_01 31:48

If your product is solid, yes, when the product is not solid, you need uh fake stories, uh association with moon, uh association with uh, you know, whatever it is and all the things.

SPEAKER_02 32:00

The the star sign and uh the the the birth month, uh what is it called? The month uh gems, no birthstones, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:06

No, these things also can be, but um not uh forced. I don't like this force.

SPEAKER_01 32:15

Thinking about every watch producer, big watch producer, produce a specific watch every year for the Chinese New Year. And ideally, as a as a concept, I like it. But then you see all of them, and they're looking all exactly the same with a little comma hero. It's the exact same basic model that they have where they had uh, I don't know, I think it's the horse here this year. They just change maybe the balancing wheel with a horse. Okay, that's it. And this is the special product that there is no effort in that, that's not luxury. You just try to sell something in that specific month, and that's it.

SPEAKER_02 32:49

We we had a nice conversation for uh about almost two hours. So I wanna I want to come to a little conclusion. I want to ask each one of you, and I will give my opinion too well. If you could choose one adjective to give to the world of luxury, so luxury to you is in one word. In one word, in one word, come on, give me give me a couple.

SPEAKER_01 33:15

No, no, give me one okay, give me a couple but I think only one will be diminishing. It is a complex topic to be the to be talking for two hours about it.

SPEAKER_02 33:27

Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 33:28

Oh, I agree, it's one word.

SPEAKER_01 33:30

Uh go for that, please.

SPEAKER_03 33:31

Yeah, luxury it's uh satisfaction.

SPEAKER_01 33:37

Interesting, yes. It's about your experience more than the uh that we have the experience. It's for you. Yes, it's for you. It's for you actually okay. You want to give it a go, Doc? Yes, but for I I totally agree with you, but it's in times to be more generic, I will say that need to have what I said uh even before, need to be and made it an expert for sure. I need to be career. Then you can like it, you can unlike it, someone will like it. But the expertise need to be there. Need to be a craftman piece, I need to be difficult to have access to, but because real difficulty of accessibility of the timing necessary to build the things, then you will have someone who is uh really interested about the jewel done in that way, like it could be someone interested in something else. So I would say if I need to use only one term, rarity probably, but in that concept, not rarity. Scarcity or rarity? Scarcity actually. Scarcity, so real scarcity.

SPEAKER_02 34:39

Of course, we are we're not talking about manipulated uh Rolex type of uh you know I I everything we talked about was uh fantastic and and uh for me for me luxury in its essence now that Xenia said uh what she said is stuck in my head.

SPEAKER_01 35:08

But I believe it could be a composition or sure. That's the thing because I think each one connected to the other.

SPEAKER_03 35:14

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_02 35:16

I was gonna for me, luxury is an experience on its own. It doesn't matter how it is, as long as as it is, as long as it happened. A travel can be luxury, traveling can be luxury, but why? Not because you get on the plane, many people get on the plane, but maybe because the experiences you are having during your trip that you bring back with you have enriched you somehow, make you become richer, and that enrichment is luxury, the ability to give yourself that possibility to be more through the objects that you like to acquire, through the passions and hobbies that you like to cultivate, and through the experiences that you have. Because everything gives you an experience, like the watch that I'm wearing today, the memory, the care, and the knowledge that I had when you built it for me, and the stories that I will tell you in the future about it. So it for me is an experience unforgettable, and it's mine again, personal for me. So so that's uh okay. So one word, yeah, so I didn't talk much this time. So I want to thank you so much for coming. Thank you, Amore, for joining us. Doctore, thank you for making the time to be with us, and uh, I hope you guys had a good time. And I I really enjoyed our conversation.

SPEAKER_00 36:44

It was so thank you very much. Thank you, thank you for having me.